This thing starts to get annoying. Last night the car decided not to go anywhere, so it was throwing Selespeed error, and only would switch gears couple of times before getting stuck in neutral. I read the error code and it was P1769 Pump driving relay stuck. I figured I can't do much so late in the night and we the left the car on some parking lot overnight.
I came back in the morning, checked the selespeed fluid level and was low which was a bit of a surprise as I checked it couple of weeks ago. So I waited until Supercheap opened, bought a can of Penrite LDAS and topped it up. The car now was drivable, however it still is throwing selespeed errors (the same as yesterday) but this time I also monitored the pressure and it was all over the place - going back and forth from 40 bar up to 59 bar. Even when the car wasn't changing gears, the pressure was still unstable. But I made it all the way home.
Now the googling reveals that it seems like accumulator is gone. Does it sound right? Especially given how I had issues with it not holding pressure too good recently? What else should I look at/check?
If that's the accumulator, is there a chance I can get one in Brisbane today?
If the accumulator sphere has failed then it may be taking in the LDAS through a ruptured membrane. If you just want a replacement today, Bazz might be good for «Запчасти» in a hurry. Or get EAI to post it up express overnight.
Else the fluid's going into your gearbox via failed o-rings. :(
When the fluid (not sure what was there initially) is leaking through a membrane, where does it end up? I've looked around under the hood but couldn't see any obvious leaks.
Given that the accumulator is only $200, I've ordered one off eBay with overnight shipping even that I'm not 100% sure on the diagnosis yet.
Now, it's my wife's car and she's losing confidence in it, which means now I have to do some preventive measures, like sourcing a set of o-rings, sensors and maybe valves.
If the sphere membrane ruptures, the (formerly) nitrogen charged side of it then fills steadily with hydraulic fluid. It can hold quite a lot.
Have you got eLearn for the car?
No, I haven't got eLearn. How do I get it?
Eastern bloc, torrent links, download an ISO for a few euro, mount it and away you go. Try the Bulgarians. ;)
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/132269809666
"P1769 Pump driving relay stuck."
This pops up when the accumulator has failed.
Do the contacts fuse/erode or does the pull-in coil burn out? Or it is just "Australiano" actually meaning the relay won't turn off at the TCU because of the problem?
I had no idea on quantifying the accumulator specs when I did my engine swap, jumped the pump relay contacts with bleeder screw open, ran the pump to purge all air, then shut off the bleed screw.
When reassembled and keyed on, it took less than 20 seconds for the pump to stop running, so I figured by Citroën standards it (pressure) was probably in the ballpark. Given their aftermarket accumulators last 2-3 years without significant loss of pressure, I reckon a safe bet on replacement interval for the Selespeed should be "replace inside four years".
It actually has nothing to do with the relay. It is caused by the accumulators internal diaphragm completely failing, so instead of trying to blow up a big rubber balloon inside a steel ball, it's actually trying to blow up a steel ball!! :o
So it goes from barely any pressure to over pressure instantly, the software interperates this as the relay being stuck on and trying to over pressure the systems.
As I may have mentioned before, unless you actually understand the systems and how to read ALL the info that diagnostic give, and what to look for, programs like MES and AlfaOBD can be very misleading at times.
In other words, changing the relay will do Jack Sh%t. ;)
;D
Thanks Bazz. That's what I figured about the error message - no way an ECU can tell a faulty relay, only by some other information, like excessive pressure or, possibly, by pump running time. And given how other symptoms (as per my previous posts) show that accumulator wasn't up to its job, I ordered one off eBay from Sydney and hopefully it'll be here tomorrow.
Here's a fairly simple test machine, it does require a little fabrication. Making one to test a Selespeed accumulator isn't any different in principle.
https://www.schaalbouw.nl/citroen/sphrtstr.htm
And the bloody AusPost have misplaced the express parcel with the accumulator that should have arrived yesterday. And apparently, their process to attempt to find it takes at least 2 business days.
That's disappointing. My recent experiences with Express Post have been pretty good, save that tracking information often wasn't updated between dispatch and receipt, until after the fact.
Got the part yet? I thought of two points that aren't perfectly illustrated in eLearn.
Firstly, the depressurising (bleed) screw above the high pressure pipe from pump into actuator body, you only need to loosen it - absolutely not remove it. Accordingly, only nip it up when done, don't "torque" it.
Secondly, make sure the area around the accumulator neck/threads is surgically clean when changing the unit; brake cleaner with a catch rag underneath is ideal. Lightly lube the seal with ATF/LHM.Selespeed fluid (etc) when refitting and make sure the seal sits properly in its recess. The sphere doesn't need tightening down like a driveshaft nut, either.
Yep, got it finally. Thanks for the tips.
Use MES/AlfaOBD to depressurise and bleed the air out of the system, it is easier and cleaner.
Finally got around to replacing the accumulator. The 27 mm spanners that are readily available are all too thick, but local metal fabrications guys did a good job of thinning it. The rest of the work is quite straightforward.
And now it's all good! No errors, gear change fine, the pressure holds for 3-4 shifts. And EOL calibration completed successfully.
Wonderful! Now you can fall in love with it again. :)
How much fluid dribbled out the dead one? Often they "rattle" due to having a lot of hydraulic oil on the wrong side of the (failed) membrane.
Quote from: Citroënbender on October 01, 2017, 07:31:08 PM
How much fluid dribbled out the dead one?
I am not too good at measuring fluid amounts when they're spilled on concrete. Yes, that's where the contents of the accumulator ended. But given that I had to top up the system with roughly 200ml of fluid, I believe that's about what had got into there.
Quote from: warsch on October 01, 2017, 03:18:25 PM
Finally got around to replacing the accumulator. The 27 mm spanners that are readily available are all too thick, but local metal fabrications guys did a good job of thinning it. The rest of the work is quite straightforward.
And now it's all good! No errors, gear change fine, the pressure holds for 3-4 shifts. And EOL calibration completed successfully.
While you were there did you check the clutch rod adjustment?
Quote from: bazzbazz on October 03, 2017, 10:36:01 PM
While you were there did you check the clutch rod adjustment?
I did that about three weeks ago when I figured that there was an issue with EOL calibration.
Just so we are clear, clutch rod adjustment is NOT part of any Automated calibration, it is a mechanical adjustment of the clutch rod length.
Yes, certainly. I adjusted it with a spanner while watching its length in MES