Hi guys
My car had no A/C gas in the system so I have
Renewed all the green Orings on the hole system
Now is time to fill with (R134) gas.
I have been told that it's needs more then a
The typical eg Commordore
To run propper
Can anyone one set me straight please
Regards Shane
I'd be surprised if it's not somewhere between 825 and 875g of R134A. One of the auto AC parts suppliers has a lookup chart posted online; it's not always right but mostly so.
(Cooldrive say early cars 710-750g, later ones 1200g. You'd want to know if you had the larger capacity system to avoid hydraulic lock from overfilling the smaller capacity one...)
Where did the gas go? Have you flushed the old oil out and added new PAG oil to the correct volume? Is the drier new?
If you lost gas through a compressor seal failure, you will have lost a measurable amount of oil, too.
Hi Shane
In addition to the above comments, I suggest that if you are not familiar with the dangers of handling Refrigerant R134a, then I would recommend that you take it to an A/C specialist. Apart from drawing vacuum for the removal of moisture, the other benefit is to determine the integrity of the A/C system (no leaks). Additionally, I am not sure you would be saving that much, based on the cost of recharge kits available on e-bay (.> $100).
thank's guys
I do have a mechanic i just need to give him the fax and figures.
One of my mates from the SA club said that (ER12) would be better and safer.
Has anyone used the ER12 option?
cheers Shane
HR-12?
It will use a much smaller charge weight, the drawback is the gas is more flammable. As your system is yet to prove itself for leakproofing and compressor efficiency, the cheapest might be a good approach.
(That opinion might attract some flak! ;) )
Hi Citroënbender,
a good friend suggestion-ed ER12 after he watched a EPA video on it.
in the video they crashed the car with ER12 in the a/c and add a valve that dump the gas into the cabin
and it did not catch fire. that is why i asked mate
i am not up with the current gas's
reg Shane
I found this page on the EPA website but i thinks it for new cars; Alfa C4 etc.
The development of MVAC systems using lower-GWP refrigerants has been encouraged by MVAC refrigerant requirements in Europe, where the EU Directive on Mobile Air Conditioning (MAC Directive)EXIT mandates transition to a refrigerant with a GWP below 150 by January 1, 2017, and in the United States by the availability of credits under the MY 2017-2025 Light-Duty Greenhouse (LD GHG) Rule (77 FR 62624, October 15, 2012).
It is important for both consumers and technicians to be aware of these alternative refrigerants, their properties, and proper servicing procedures. A printable brochure is available for new climate-friendly motor vehicle air conditioning refrigerants. EPA's regulatory requirements for the servicing of MVAC systems apply to all three of these refrigerants.
HFO-1234yf (R-1234yf)
GWP of 4
Acceptable, subject to use conditions, for new passenger cars and light-duty trucks only (March 29, 2011, 76 FR 17488; March 26, 2012, 77 FR 17344)
Mildly flammable (ASHRAE A2L), but can be used safely
Models using HFO-1234yf include: Cadillac XTS, Chevrolet Spark EV, BMW i3 and i8, Chrysler 200, Chrysler 300, Dodge Challenger, Dodge Charger, Dodge Dart, Dodge Durango, Jeep Cherokee, Jeep Wrangler, Ram 1500, Fiat 500 and 500L, Alfa Romeo 4C, Honda Fit EV, Tesla Model S, Range Rover, and Range Rover Sport
Required use conditions:
HFO-1234yf MVAC systems must adhere to all of the safety requirements of SAE J639 (adopted 2011), including requirements for a flammable refrigerant warning label, high-pressure compressor cutoff switch and pressure relief devices, and unique fittings. For connections with refrigerant containers for use in professional servicing, use fittings must be consistent with SAE J2844 (revised October 2011).
Manufacturers must conduct Failure Mode and Effect Analysis (FMEA) as provided in SAE J1739 (adopted 2009). Manufacturers must keep the FMEA on file for at least three years from the date of creation.
Carbon Dioxide (CO2, R-744)
Ok, I think someone is getting their A/C Refrigerants mixed up, I have no idea which gas you guys are referring to (R-12 Perhaps? Which is no longer available and banned worldwide) but you may be thinking of Hy-Chill?
In which case you might like to read the following -
http://www.airchill.net.au/auto-motive-air-conditioning-gases.html (http://www.airchill.net.au/auto-motive-air-conditioning-gases.html)
https://hychill.com.au/products/minus-30 (https://hychill.com.au/products/minus-30)
Thanks Bazzbazz
I am just looking for the best gas to re-gas my 164 that wont leak out through the hoses that were made for R12.
So many people are telling me not to go with R134 because the molecules are smaller than the R12 molecules.
Also some people have said that its not the same PSI in a commodore or the common new cars.
So what is the the PSI to put in for my 164?
I am confused and going a little crazy with the whole issue.
Cheers
Yup, systems made for R-12 can't use R134a, the R134a molecule is much smaller and will seep through the hose materiel and the seals.
Hy-Chill however is replacement for both gasses and has a larger molecular size. When recharging systems you go by "Charge Weight" for each particular car & its system. If your 164 has the standard factory A/C system it will take 370 grams of Hy-Chill.
However if your system has been sitting empty for a long time you will need the following done first at a minimum-
1/ New Dryer fitted
2/ System vacuumed for extended period
3/ Extended leak test
I have been to see my mechanic today to ask him if he can get some Hy-Chill gas he said no but he does have refrigerator gas that he put in refrigeration trucks.
Thankfully if it doesn't work then no cost, but I must confess I'm a little nervous about it.
I looked up what gas it may be and i think it maybe this one.
"Modern refrigerators usually use a refrigerant called HFC-134a (1,1,1,2-Tetrafluoroethane), which does not deplete the ozone layer, instead of Freon. A R-134a is now becoming very uncommon in Europe. Newer refrigerants are being used instead. The main refrigerant now used is R-600a, or isobutane."
Bazzbazz ; I have a new recever dryer and all new green O'ring
cheers
Whoa there!
Commercial fridgie gas is not 1234YF, R134A or directly interchangeable with your original R12.
Can you get in touch with Hychill for a list of suppliers/installers in your area?
What CB said. You can get Hy-chill from Bursons.
As your system is a R-12 system the ONLY gasses available that you can use are R-12 or Hy-Chill Minus 30.
So unless you pay to have your system converted to run on R134a (very expensive) your only option is Hy-Chill Minus 30.
I honestly don't think you needed a dye to spot that as the leak point!! ;D ;D ;D
Bazz, you idiot.
That's the AC primer bulb; you squeeze and release it half a dozen times before turning the AC on, to charge the compressor with sufficient oil/refrigerant for suction on the low side.
;)
Oh for the love of . . . . ! ::)
Do you know how many of the great unwashed are now going to read that and think you're serious. :o
;D
Thank you guys
It turns out the mechanic left the gas on so it all leaked out, oops.
I have him getting hy-chill minus 30 from Bursons for 30.
Will probably need 2 cans.
Let you know how it goes.
Reg Shane.
Not trying to be a knob or anything, but you have flushed out darn near all the old compressor oil and will be adding new oil known to be compatible with the HyChill, right?
Hello awesome alfa people lol
Well i have been waiting for the mechanic to let me know went to rock up but no joy so far.
so i poped by and asked he is still waiting himself so looks like next week then?
I toke the kids to Robe, I had forgotten how much power the Q has over the hilux 4x4 i have been driving for the lest year.
i over toke a van and the speedo shot up like billyo i looked back to the car behind me to see with shock and or. I am a very carefuller driver so i got a bit of a shock so i just did the 110 all the way home.
reg shane
PS if anyone needs some trim fix up just let me know eg; gear boot,gear knobs, steering wheels, seat etc photo available
little up date
So I took the car to my mechanic on Thursday morning, and I did not hear anything all day. But at 430 pm he told me that the top of the gas cylinder had been broken off in delivery! So my car is still there - waiting... one day.
I think the universe is trying to tell me some thing LOL
just have to press on then
Regards Shane
Struth.
Would just about be time to invest in some of your own gear. Nitrogen bottle, gauge set, vacuum pump, scales.
Quote from: Citroënbender on June 02, 2018, 10:01:35 PM
Struth.
Would just about be time to invest in some of your own gear. Nitrogen bottle, gauge set, vacuum pump, scales.
Double ended sister twister . . . .
Quote from: Citroënbender on June 02, 2018, 10:01:35 PM
Struth.
Would just about be time to invest in some of your own gear. Nitrogen bottle, gauge set, vacuum pump, scales.
yes it's getting that way. I NOT STRESSED NO NOT AT ALL
john Lenin use to repeat number 9 number 9 number 9 etc
Feel the Condenser radiator, it should be cold on one side neutral in the middle and cold on the other. If not it is blocked.
Are ANY of the pipes getting cold?
Could be a sticky expansion valve?
Is it a one of the compressors with a mechanical or electronic variable displacement?
OK, your TX valve is almost certainly accessed at the firewall where the high/low pipes attach.
Later 156s may use a dessicant cartridge inserted vertically into one end of the condensor, instead of a separate drier.
Compressors like the SD7V16 are variable displacement and their modulating valve is not a stranger to failure. All the replacement valves seem to be Chinoiserie, does the new part work, toss a coin?
If it's a JTS the desiccant tube is in the end of the condenser.
Twinsparks have a cylinder type unit under the RH guard next to the power steering cooling coil.
Quote from: BazzTwinsparks have a cylinder type unit under the RH guard next to the power steering cooling coil.
Which is compatible with one marketed for Camrys. So, quite affordable. :)
http://www.autofrost.com.au/store/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=149
Quote from: sportiva on July 09, 2018, 04:04:39 PM
Hi Baz
I doubt my JTS has a serviceable TX valve. If the car has one it's deep inside the HVAC system
CB I found what would be a receiver drier in any other car in the condenser are they replaceable or do you just replace the condenser
In JTS cars the drier is in a tube that runs down the passenger sice of the A/C Condenser Radiator. You replace just the receiver/drier innards that's in the tube on the end.
Here is what the replacement looks like -
156 JTS - https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Alfa-Romeo-156-BMW-X5-E81-E90-BEHR-HELLA-Receiver-Drier-Accumulator-A-C-1997/152544995927?hash=item238463ea57:g:AYYAAOSwiCRUfGCu (https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Alfa-Romeo-156-BMW-X5-E81-E90-BEHR-HELLA-Receiver-Drier-Accumulator-A-C-1997/152544995927?hash=item238463ea57:g:AYYAAOSwiCRUfGCu)
147/156 Twinspark - https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/RECEIVER-DRIER-ALFA-ROMEO-156-99-06/292352742422?hash=item441194d416:g:JmgAAOSw0A9aILnH (https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/RECEIVER-DRIER-ALFA-ROMEO-156-99-06/292352742422?hash=item441194d416:g:JmgAAOSw0A9aILnH)
It looks like the TX valve is buried deep in the HVAC box, deduct points from the system designers for that one.