Hello,
I joined this site because I am looking to buy an Alfa. After reading some of the responses to the "for sale" adds, I have to say that some of you lot are bl00dy rude and inconsiderate.
Don't know what I mean? Read of of the replies in http://www.alfaclubvic.org.au/forum/index.php?topic=3580.0
If you don't like the price someone is asking, then don't buy it. If you aren't a genuine buyer, don't get involved in the discussion. If you really feel the buyer is asking too much or too little, send them a PM instead of publicly being rude to them.
Maybe I missed the section in the forums rules that stated all sellers must list items for less than market value and accept smart a$$ remarks from members that aren't remotely interested in actually buying the item.
This section of the forum is here to provide a much needed service to members, both buyers and sellers. If you keep sticking it to the sellers, soon they'll go elsewhere.
Ciao
here here! agreed!
Geeteevee Look up the meaning of a forum! ::)
Have you visited any other forums ie Porsche,Ferrari and read how they conduct themselves?
Sellers attempting to sell cars at way over the market price and not offering a warranty should go elsewhere...(it's called Ebay)
The classic part of it all is.You have called "bloody rude and inconsiderate" members who are trying to protect the buyer !!!(And you claim you are a first time buyer) and all this within your first post!
Wait a minute this sounds very similar to a private message I received ;)
Are some of our members signed in by more than one alias ::)
John
Having read the thread in question I don't know what the fuss is about. One of the members has put something into the marketplace for sale and in turn has received feedback from the market. I don't see anything rude in the replies and, judging by his responses, neither did the vendor (who happily engaged in an open discussion with them). Maybe if I recite it backwards I might hear the messages you did?? ;D
Frankly I thought your outburst was ruder than anything those guys said.
Rory
Errrr & Hello to you, 1st poster.
Try getting out of bed on the other side tomorrow morning. I'm sure everybody will notice the difference.
I don't consider this site the place to get a bargain, ebay and trading post cater for that market... But even those sites can in my opinion have some vendors with strange ideas. In general it would want to be a real special 5 year old car to be worth near/over 30% of the original price... but if you can get it all the best to you.
I'd like to think this site is the place the better than average examples are available... but then again I'm a dreamer.
if you are looking to buy an alfa ill sell you my 156 selespeed 2000mdl black with all the acces im only after $200,000 then ill go buy the 8c on ebay
p.s to everyone else if i get the 8c you are all welcome to drive it and at what ever speed you like ;)
I'd love to know what qualifies dehne, Choderboy or JOHN G as expert motor vehicle valuers. Did any of you guys inspect the car? Perhaps you know the car already? Not worth $15k you say? I am surprised you guys didn't seta price for him. How about $11k, or is it worth closer to $7k?
Currently, there are 5 GTV6es on carsales.com.au/carpoint.com.au (prices range $8500 - $18000), none on ebay, drive.com.au or tradingpost.com.au. So how can $15000 be too much? Sure, it's at the higher end of the price range, but not unrealistic. See, 15mins of research and I can find out roughly the going asking price range.
Here's a thread where a guy is looking for a GTV6 for less than $5k. Read Davidm1750 response.
http://www.carpoint.com.au/all-cars/results.aspx?N=834+1216+1247+1282+1252+1246+4294967249+4294967170&keywords=
If I was in the market for a GTV6, I would not consider $15k unreasonable for the right car. But that's only my opinion. There aren't many cars around that are worth less than a stuffed alfa or more rewarding to drive and own than a really nice one.
Okay - I'm going to jump in here, you might not all like what I have to say. This forum has been running for almost four years - set up and funded by AROCA Vic and has become a national forum with members from all states and overseas. A large number of non-AROCA members are part of the forum, and both members and non-members get lots of value from advice, and buying and selling parts and cars. Although there are other moderators in the forum, I'm still the 'webmaster' and consider it my responsibility to monitor and make sure the community behaves itself, and the reputation of AROCA is not tarnished. I take it pretty seriously because I think it's important. I've never had to write a set of rules, and mostly I haven't had to act to remove many posts or ask members to alter behaviour. Most people act pretty reasonably towards each other.
I agree with GeeTeeVee - I really don't like the responses that people are making to For Sale items. I don't believe there is anything to be gained for anyone by posting a vindictive post attacking the sellers price or description. I don't think these are genuinely attempts to 'protect' a potential buyer - they sound more like showing off your knowledge for your own self-gratification. This type of post encourages more posts in the same ilk, and suddenly the forum is not a very nice place.
I've discussed this with the AROCA Vic president and other members of the committee, and they share my opinion. Therefore I'm now going to apply some rules to the 'buy/swap/sell' area of the forum.
ONLY reply with questions or clarifications about the item for sale. Do NOT provide an opinion about the item's value or the asking price or in any way try to undermine a seller. If you have an issue with the item, PM the seller, or PM me or another moderator in order to take action. If it's urgent my mobile number is 0400 013 175 - call me and I'll deal with things.
I'm going to remove any post within the Buy/Swap/Sell forum that is off topic or breaks these rules.I hope this is clear and I haven't pissed too many folk off, even if you don't agree with me.
Quote from: JOHN G on October 15, 2009, 03:51:50 PM
Wait a minute this sounds very similar to a private message I received ;)
Are some of our members signed in by more than one alias ::)
You'll have to take my word for it John G - although GeeTeeVee's post sounds a lot like my PM to you, it's not a sock puppet.
All
I suppose that is what the forum is all about, so people can share their thoughts and opinions, it has been great help for me ever since I joined, however I dont agree with everything that is posted, everyone is entitled their own opinion. Keep up the good work everyone.
Ed
Gee Tee Vee welcome to a day in my working life. Every body else is an expert. I cannot believe that I can continue to survive knowing so little. However I do agree with your thinking
hey fellers relax just read all this and it really doesnt affect me or what im selling in the least, as a matter of fact i like reading what people think, im not 15yrs of age anymore and buying selling my 1st car, i have bought/sold so many in the last 30yrs that ive heard all the specialty comments and have recieved advise on how to and what to, but at the end of the day all of us know what our possessions are worth and if we get what we want and the buyer/seller reach agreement then a deal is made simple. this is a forum and it does get interesting i hope it stays that way cheers
GEE TEE VEE i think you have completly missed the point of what we were saying we gave a honest indication of what we thought of the price but i am not going to say hey it only worth $5000 so thats what ill give you all we were was offering was a bit of advise and to say keep the gtv
i also think you should read a few more of the posts that are within this forum before you go out and say that we are all rude because it is also us members who you will rely on when you are having probs with ur alfa and with topics and posts like this you may or may not recieve the help u need from someone who could fix the prob in 5mins for free or you end up taking it to a mech who charges you $5000 but it up to you this is just ANOTHER bit of friendly advice
just read the add in question and i have to ask whats the problem i didnt see anything out of order just a bunch of guys expressing their opinion wait a minute isnt that what a forum is.i supose we all get a bit touchy when someone tells us our stuff is not worth what we think it is but lighten up fella dont take it too seriously you will end up bursting a blood vesal anyhow if you guys want to see how the overseas people do it log onto www.e30zone.net this is probably the best bmw forum site i have seen we should aspire to be so profesional in our atitudes,but hey thats my opinion cheers ;D
Ok guys hang on here for a second. In the first instance, in my opinion and given that I don't know many of you guys, I will speak a little dispassionately. In my mind while GeeTeeVee is perfectly entitled to his opinion, the equal is that so is everyone else. Its called democracy, but in accepting that this comes with some level of responsibility. So while it is perfectly fair to provide comment and opinion on someone else's car's value as based on your knowledge of the market place, or from your own experience, it is a bit beyond the pale if people start attacking each other for holding a particular opinion.
In all fairness while it is perfectly clear that GeeTeeVee has taken issue with the comments that others have made concerning a particular GTV6 for sale and the asking price, I also would respectively suggest that his comments are to an extent out of order. I too have read the thread he took issue with and didn't see anything particularly wrong with it. I have seen far worse for instance on the Alfabb, and yet people posting there by in large manage to remain civil. I would therefore suggest that people need to step back a little from all of this and take stock.
It was interesting that some comments I made in the past on the values of these types of cars was dragged into this thread, as a way of exemplifying a particular point. While I understand the purpose I suspect to an extent I am a little concerned that my views were used as an example without at least the curtosey of putting them in context. Not that I actually recall what this was beyond perhaps some discussion on the broad range in values of Alfetta based GTV6s. I would contend that based on current market values such comments probably still hold true.
The market place in the end from my observation will always dictate the value of a car, rather than the owners beliefs as to what it may be worth. In addition, market values for some cars will greatly differ not just between countries but and to an extent between different States even here in Australia. Good luck in the end to a seller if they can get what they hope to.
I also think it is perfectly appropriate that Even as a webmaster has posted some rules around this sort of topic and therefore would tentatively suggest that all of us who contribute to discussions on the forum try to abide by them.
For the record, while I may not be a current member of AROCA I was a member from 1983 to the early 2000s, (Victoria Club), was and remain a founding member of Club Motori Italia (CMI) here in Tasmania, and remain a true and loyal Alfa owner of some 26 years. I am well known to a number of the Victorian Alfa club members including your current President. Please in future can we all try to be civil in these kind of discussions. Cheers David
Quotehey fellers relax just read all this and it really doesnt affect me or what im selling in the least, as a matter of fact i like reading what people think, im not 15yrs of age anymore and buying selling my 1st car, i have bought/sold so many in the last 30yrs that ive heard all the specialty comments and have recieved advise on how to and what to, but at the end of the day all of us know what our possessions are worth and if we get what we want and the buyer/seller reach agreement then a deal is made simple. this is a forum and it does get interesting i hope it stays that way cheers
Nicely worded Franck ;)
Generally agree with your post too David, but then I've had a few glasses of vino and am generally agreeing with anything right now ::)
I have seen other buy/sell posts where the responses were probably over-the-top in the manner Evan describes. In my opinion (no disrespect Evan, I do appreciate your role here) this wasn't one of them. Put these words together in a sentence - storm, tea, cup. Just a shame some restrictions have now had to have been put in place; everybody loses as a result.
Speaking of cups, I need to fill mine with some more shiraz....
Evan fair point you make but whenever someone is trying to sell their car on this site if its not sold within a few weeks then they ask why isnt anyone interested. Therefore feedback is given by people who may not be interested in buying but whom feel that they might add a valid point.
GEETEEVEE........the cars you mention on carsales asking that type of money have been for sale for more than 6 months so i guess that is the market again showing that maybe it isnt priced correctly.
But really everyone is free to ask the money that they want, and in the mean time FRANCK gets to enjoy the car for longer, my advice again KEEP IT!!!
I am still trying to find terra firma on this site but I dare say some people on the Forum are also having a head scratch from time to time to work out who dfk is this guy.
Well, my bio is not that exotic.
I am an old fart that loves transaxles.
I make lots of personal comments which readers love or hate but always in honesty
I try some comedy ocassionaly to break the technical boredom
I endeavour to be helful with technical contributions where I feel I have some competency
I aim to address the topic and avoid attacking the writer
The partner to direct attacks of the person is flaming which to my dismay goes on a bit on this Forum and is totally needless. It's just a form of bullying. It polarises people and the childish carry on is a sure sign of a lack of maturiy and a small weiner (I lied about the maturity thing..)
So Evan I commend you for throwing a ferret in the chicken coop just to see if they're awake even if some feathers do fly... I would also support a half dozen or so basic Forum etiquette compliace codes as a condition of using this Forum. It's done elsewhere and your committee should have no problems coming up with common sense list.
As for the car prices, well it can depend on so many factors and it can go logarithmically in relation to its availablity or uniqueness. Average prices will always be just that, average. Recently some 105 ragtops have been selling locally for over $30 grand. A couple of years ago there was a concourse 2litre 105 selling for $40 grand. Buying original cars is one thing but try a baremetal restoration and bring it up to speed with decent imported wheels and modifications so it can take its place with contemporay sports cars on the road, you wouldn't get much change out of $50Grand. So unless you intimately know the car...
and so endeth lecture. :)
Im only new here, but may i say if one is selling a car one in a public forum one should be prepared for that forum to 'measure' its worth???
I see no issue in an opinion on a sale... this IS a forum, its not Ebay....... i really do thinks its as simple as that. Its our privalage as forum members to participate in topics posted. A post re a sale on this forum is not exclusively an 'add'... by merely appearing on the forum as a topic it lends itself to opinion by default no?
my two cents
Oh and i thought that protest post ' bloody rude and inconsiderate' is overly aggessive self righteous and lacking in appreciation for the what this forum is.
pull your head in gee tee vee