Hi all, we are now the proud owners of an 87 2.5L 75. The car was picked up for a song as there were a few minor issues with it. I have sorted out most of them but the biggest headache is the rear brakes.
First up the car had been sitting a while prior to arriving on our doorstep, more than likely with the hand brake on. When we got the car running I took it for a drive, it felt like the hand brake was on full. No problem I thought the callipers have probably locked up due to lack of use and the hand brake being left on....... easy to fix.........How wrong was I?????
I have done all the research into them and how to adjust them. But even after doing all that nada.
I have wound out (as per instructions) the pistons to try and remove the pads but nothing seems to be happening, as in, they have no moved so much as a thousand's of an inch.
So I thought lets remove the disk and callipers and overhaul them. But it looks like a catch 22 here, as if I drop the drive shafts and remove the bolts holding the disks on I will still not be able to remove the disk to get to the calliper bolts..........well that's how it looks to me.
Any pointers would be gratefully received. I am quite handy on the spanners and know my way around a car (use to work as a motor mechanic) but this one has me stumped. I guess the main thing here is I am looking for the easiest way out of the situation without having to resort to dropping the whole transaxle.
Just on the side here too, the car is being done up as a dirt rally car and as such the is a fair amount of stripping of unwanted/ needed parts such as door glass if anyone is interested.
Cheers
Phil
I'm no expert (bwahahaha not even close) but sometimes the handbrake mechanism freezes on, you can spray the handbrake lever (on the inner side of the caliper where the cable hooks on) with some WD-40 and leave to soak, then apply some violence and it should release.
Used to happen occasionally on the Sud when it had the inboard calipers (on the front same-ish as an Alfetta/75 rear), and has happened on my Giulietta too.
have tried the WD40 and violence....................nothing :'(
we bled the system and got new fluid through the bleed nipples there is a good "feel" the the brake peddle.
and the fronts are working well, just not a lot happening out the back, was hopping that driving around for a little bit would generate some heat and free things up but that did not work either, boo!
Phil,
With the pads out and the axels dropped you should be able to remove the disks.
On a V6 you might also have to remove the 'top hats' that I think hold the disks to the diff output shaft.
Then you should be able to get to the calliper mounting bolts.
Alan.
Sounds like Phil is having trouble with step 1 (pads out). Pistons frozen in caliper bores?
I know you said you wound out the adjusters as per instructions, but just in case... On each caliper there's an inner and an outer adjuster. The inner adjuster you need a small socket (5mm or 6mm?) on an extension and it just winds back. The outer adjuster has a lock nut and a hex key bolt, you have to unlock the lock nut and hold it in place while you wind the adjuster with the hex key. From memory the hex key turns the opposite way than you'd expect - e.g. clockwise will back the adjuster off, loosening the pads so they can be removed.
The special tool for operating the outer lock nut while you adjust the hex key is just a socket welded to a handle...
yep did all the adjusters the correct way, the hex bolts are 7mm and to back them off you turn counter clockwise for the left inner calliper and clockwise for the right inner calliper.
regarding the outer calliper both locking nuts are 17mm and you undo them counter clockwise a max of one turn and the allan key turns clockwise.
So yes as I have no movement I am stuck at even removing the pads................
Hi there
What I have fone in the past is take the lock pins out that hold the pads in then I have use a screwdriver and hammer and force the pads out.
Cheers for that, I was thinking along those lines myself but there is not much room to move
So the handbrake cable is disconnected, and the arms don't move at all?
cable disconnected and the arms do move, but there is no movement of the pads when I try to wind them back.
I have had a good look and I think there is probably a millimetre (or less) of pad material left but its hard to tell.
I would say the piston has seized, so muscle will be the only winner
that's what I am thinking..... :(
+ 1 on using some sort of persuading device.
A pry bar will usually solve this problem. Also, you can use the disc itself as a pry bar/lever if all driveshaft bolts are undone and the disc is ready to be removed.
Cheers.
ok thanks for the info and suggestions will try removing all the bolts and using the disk, will let you know how I go
You still had the bolts in?!
You need to remove these to remove the disc, they go through it to the output flange.
getting the pads out is the first issue to tackle as the callipers are seized............
Yes I understand that,
You won't be able to use the disc as a lever with the pry bar unless the bolts are out, that was what I meant.
My apologies probably just misread what you typed.
no apologies needed, all comments welcome........
this weekend will get a bit done, plan getting its bum in the air and removing all bolts dropping drive shafts and having a "bash" at getting the pads out and disks removed :D
just a quick update, making slow progress but have un-seized the callipers............was in the progress of undoing the drive shaft bolts and giving the bolt(s) a good whack (through the extension bar and and hex drive) to help with freeing up of the bolts, the whole lot want "bang" and the driveshaft started turn......... jumped in the car pushed down on the brake peddle and the rears lock again, so tapped the disk with a hammer and hay presto it goes free again......did that a few times and things begining to move a lot better ;D
still going to remove everything as it needs a rebuild but happy camper now :)
Excellent news!
" When in doubt, give it a clout!!" ;D
Well OK, so I have tried in earnest to undo these drive shaft bolts................exactly how hard are they supposed to be to undo???????
I went out and got an 8mm allen key socket drive, sprayed liberal amounts of WD40 and have been trying to undo them using an extension bar and rattle gun no movement so far, would need a longer extension bar (to clear the wheel well) if i was to use a "crack" bar..........has anyone tried an impact driver to undo these bolts?? Any other ideas????
cheers
Phil
If the bolts have not been off in awhile, they will be a pain to get out. You are correct in using an allen key socket and make sure it is a really good one so it fits perfectly and squarely, an extension is good (but not too long to put the socket at an angle), have someone hold the wheel while you give it a good gentle lever ie longer ratchet. If you happen(and you will as there are 12 to do) to round off the hex head, you will need to cut the bolt head off with an angle grinder. Good luck with the fun and games. Seems you are on the right path, rough as it may be. If it gets tough, walk away and have a drink then come back and swear at it more, this seems to work and make easy after awhile, I think!!!
:D thanks Neil.............I'm having a beer 8)
got a kingcrome allen key socket fits well, going to giver the impact driver idea a go tomorrow, never know it might just work..............
Second Neil's grinder comment. If they are on solid likely you will round off at least a couple of them so grinder at the ready....:) Plenty of spares lying around in peoples bolt bins so nothing lost.
Cheers, yes will get a thin cutting wheel tomorrow :)
Another way is with a cold chisel, sometimes you can get them to turn but of course they are very second hand afterwards.
Angle grinder with a 1mm cutting blade is more fun, more exciting, more spectacular and more satisfying (mmmm, power tool) than a bloody cold chisel!!!! If you want cold chisel, go listen to Jimmy Barnes.
What I do is use a normal Allen key, then a 22 ml ring spanner to extend they leverage then use my foot and press down, can get more pressure this way than any other
mmmmmmmmmmmm power tools, because 8 fingers and 2 thumbs are so overrated ;D
Quote from: Luckyphil on March 05, 2013, 05:31:21 AM
mmmmmmmmmmmm power tools, because 8 fingers and 2 thumbs are so overrated ;D
You asked for help Phil! Did this job first time oh 20 years ago. Still got 8 fingers and 2 thumbs... ;D
Seriously though, you're right about safety. Always use welders gloves and safety goggles when using a grinder. And keep an extinguisher nearby.
well I'm going to use this as an excuse to remove the fuel tank, pump and filter and relocate them into the boot when I have finished.
this would be a bit easier if the car was on a hoist and not on the ground, but yes will take my time, first up will be trying the impact driver, grinding will be the last resort :D
plan on retaining all extremity's as well, hehe
thank you all for the input guys will keep you posted :)
as I have decided to "walk away" from the drive shafts for a few days, I turned my attention to other jobs that need doing so I removed all the door glass, winding mechanisms, central locking and wiring this afternoon, woohoo I made some progress :D
Now I have all the internal door bits that have been removed with care, and I do not want to throw it away as it might be of use to someone else, anyone interested??
Phil, if you are walking away for few days, use that time wisely. Every day get underneath and give each bolt a big smack with a heavy hammer, nice and square so as not to damage anything A solid hit with a heavy hammer is better than rapping away like a woodpecker using a small hammer. Then spray with a decent penetrant.
Repeat a few times over a few days. Hopefully by the time you get to undoing them, they will have released their hold.
Cheers Paul, gave the bolts another WD40 bath this arvo, will give then another whack tomorrow morning :)
Quote from: dehne on March 04, 2013, 11:47:32 PM
What I do is use a normal Allen key, then a 22 ml ring spanner to extend they leverage then use my foot and press down, can get more pressure this way than any other
I strongly suggest that NOBODY EVER tries this. This is how you strip bolts and ruin your tools. Bad practice. No feel.
BAD ADVICE DEHNE!
Phil,
Have you stripped any of the bolt heads yet? Or managed to crack any?
not yet, but did remove the fuel tank, pump and filter yesterday. going to have another crack at the bolts today
woohoo, all done!!!! everything came apart quite well, no stripped bolts no need to grind anything too ;D