Hi Again.
I have had to remove the cam shaft to remove and replace that Variator. This all when well until I have now tried to get back to the new timing belt and when I put the cam shaft back with the new Variator the cam sprocket will not adjust back to where it was before see marks are 2 teeth out.
My thought is the Variator has a different final spot and I need to loosen that sprocket and fit it half way in its adjustment. Ignoring the marks I put on the intake side but make sure the balance shaft lines up with the marks on the exhaust side.
The cam shaft has been put back on the same angle as the clamping tool has longed up.
Am I correct? Had to find info on the Variator install
Cheers Matt
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Thanks for that, I can't seem to find a TDC tool in Australia, any chance I can borrow or buy one someone is finished with? Not keen to trust a screwdriver test on the TDC. I just can't fathom why there isn't a TDC mark like every other car. How hard can it be? What could possibly go wrong?
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Ok, Matt I have one word for you - STOP!
I don't mean to sound rude or condescending but I am afraid you are dong many critical steps all wrong and you will end up in tears or worse!
If you like give me a call around 7.00pm tomorrow nite and I will talk you through the process.
And there IS a timing mark on the engine, just that few people know where or what to look for. (And no, I am NOT talking about the mark on the plastic timing belt cover)
Barry
On The Spot Alfa
0405 721613
Yep I STOPPED a while ago. I have done enough timing belts on enough different cars to know when to stop.
Thanks Barry would love your advice. I'll give you a call tomorrow night.
Any tips one where I can find a TDC tool to get it freighted tomorrow?
Cheers
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Just out of curiosity, WHY have you put white out marks on the new belt? They come with timing marks on them new.
That the old belt. My intention was the transfer those marks onto the new belt to put them back. Found the marks on the new belt after this. Just concerned it's 2 teeth different
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All sorted via Skype/Facetime/Signal?
Or is it double shots, no ice, all 'round?
YOU did sort it, or are you asking has it been sorted?
No phone call yet, but i don't think he's in that much of a rush.
No, I haven't had any input other than comments posted here. :)
My money is on the camshaft gears not being loosened when fitting the belt. When you install a new belt the 4 bolts on the intake gear (variator) need to be loose and the 1 bolt on the
exhaust gear needs to be loose. You'l find both gears will have some movement back and forth. Roughly centralise each, install new belt, tension the belt and then tighten the 4 + 1 bolts to the correct torque. remove cam locks, Turn motor by hand 2 revolutions and recheck tension.
All belts stretch differently, new and old, the tension takes up slack as it ages.
Hopefully you've followed the workshop guide as torque values are important. On a side note, I've had great success on rebuilding the variators at a cost of about $20 with the Alfa OEM kit.
Only marks to be concerned about on the timing belt is the direction of travel. Balance belt has marks that need aligning.
Do give Bazz a call Matty. Its an expensive and heartbreaking job to not get right, but very satisfying when you do.
Quote from: Cool Jesus on June 26, 2018, 10:01:35 PM
Only marks to be concerned about on the timing belt is the direction of travel.
That's not quite correct. The main timing belt DOES have specific timing marks other than the direction of travel, 2 of them in fact, and are there to ensure you have everything set correctly.
So the other day I loosened the 4 bolts and sliding the gear around as far as it would go would not line up the marks on the old belt
Thanks heaps for the help and BazzBazz I will get to calling you, I've been hammered with End of Financial year jobs and then two 7:00 meeting in a row. Maybe tomorrow night.
So do I need to order a TDC tool or is there a work around? BazzBazz you said there is a secret squirrel mark does that mean I don't need the tool? And how tight it tight on the tentioner?
I haven't touched it since Sunday. I moved onto brakes at least I can do that.
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Quote from: bazzbazz on June 26, 2018, 10:56:05 PM
That's not quite correct. The main timing belt DOES have specific timing marks other than the direction of travel, 2 of them in fact, and are there to ensure you have everything set correctly.
I stand corrected. Yes I have seen the markings on the belt. Will note where they land next belt change.
So Update. Thanks BazzBazz for the tips, I have it running and it is Sweet. One of the smoothest engines I've seen run. Heaps better then when I picked up, also the engine light was on I assumed Variator / stuff that would be fixed with the belts changed. Well engine light is back on. OBD scan shows cam sensor🤦🏻♂️. Any way of testing this befor I buy another one and can I take the exhaust cam sprocket off and re time and tension the timing belt without taking the balance belt off or I need to start from scratch?
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I warned you didn't I !!!
I think your home made Counter Torque Tool may have bent the sensor rail on the back of the exhaust pulley. Or it came in contact with the sensor itself.
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I don't think so. It locks in snug in 3 spots and is well away from the ring. I did my feet to keep away from the sensor.
The error didn't come up until we drove it for 25 minutes and then started it again.
It's main issue now is not being keen to start when she is warm.
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Are you SURE it's the Camshaft sensor and not the Crankshaft Sensor?
Either can fail all on their own, but it is usually the Crankshaft sensor that is heat affected.
Starts first go when cold, hard to start or won't start when hot is usually the Crankshaft sensor.
Tacho needle that won't rise is another clue of dead CAS.
(I had used the word "виагра" in English and it blocked my post!)
I had read that the 2 sensors not talking to each other is a common fault. Apart from an oscilloscope is there a way of testing the Cam or crank sensor with a Multi meter? The OBD scanner said it's the Cam one but it is just a SP tools OBD scanner.
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No that's not correct, the data from both sensors are independently fed into the ECU, they do not "Talk" to each other.
Simple, check with your scanner that the error is still there, DON'T clear it. Then disconnect the plug to the Camshaft Sensor and check with your scanner again. If the original error is the only one there still then it is the Camshaft sensor that faulty. If a new one pops up then the original error is the Crankshaft Sensor.
Don't forget to plug the Camshaft sensor back in after the elimination test.
If the car won't start when hot, it's almost guaranteed to be the crank angle sensor.
Also believe it or not, a faulty crank angle sensor won't always log a code.
Change the crank angle sensor, I think you'll find it'll fix your problem. No point in doing cam sensor until you do the easy job first.
mick.
Quote from: bazzbazz on July 11, 2018, 06:15:06 PM
No that's not correct, the data from both sensors are independently fed into the ECU, they do not "Talk" to each other.
Simple, check with your scanner that the error is still there, DON'T clear it. Then disconnect the plug to the Camshaft Sensor and check with your scanner again. If the original error is the only one there still then it is the Camshaft sensor that faulty. If a new one pops up then the original error is the Crankshaft Sensor.
Don't forget to plug the Camshaft sensor back in after the elimination test.
I have tried to find the Camshaft sensor plug and haven't been able to locate it other then it's Blue and 3 pins. Any tips on where it is?
I'll look into the crank sensor change
Thanks Matt
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It's the blue plug on top of the drivers side of the plenum.
Also just to clarify, when you disconnect the Camshaft angle sensor, you must then try to start the motor to see if disconnecting it makes a new error pop up. If the same error pops up and no new ones, then you have confirmed it is the Camshaft Sensor.
And as Mick said, it is the Crankshaft Sensor that is temperature dependent on failure, thus the reason why what your scanner says
is confusing and why you need to do this test to confirm its not feeding you bullshit.
So we have ordered the new camshaft sensor and befor I get into doing the belt again I want to buy some long bolts for the fan locking blocks. I believe they are an m7 as the three bolt joints in Port Macquarie could not help. Can someone tell me the longest bolt I can use as well as the size and thread? I am on the Gold Coast this week so I'll check out what the bolt guy up here has. Thanks Matt
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Quote from: MattyG on August 05, 2018, 11:50:15 PM
I want to buy some long bolts for the fan locking blocks.
I assume you mean Cam Locking Blocks? Any decent bolt place has them, try Bolt King if there is one of the Gold Coast.
Yep it was a bit late. Cam blocks it is. But How long can I use and they look like a fine thread. Are they an m7 1.25 thread?
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I think it's M7×1,00 thread. Chris at Fasteners Galore/Bolt Warehouse should have them, not sure if in a socket head though.