So yes I have been alerted that replacement door seals seems to be a PITA.
I found what I thought were a good suitable seal, right profile, nice and spongey..
Got them from Rare Spares Canberra, and they were for a Holden Gemini.
But.....they are not right...hard to close doors...impossible to close them fully..
I thought I'd let them bed in for a month or two, but to no avail...not even a tiny improvement.
I have heard this is a common problem, even with seals from Highwood Alfa and other reputable suppliers.
So I have decided to put my feelers out for anyone who may have a good pair of used seals..
I am guessing they are compatible across all 116 GTV's.
Thanks in advance..
Hi Sudsy
Before discarding your new door seals, I would try to rectify them, by modifying the seal to allow the entrapment of air to escape within the rubber hollow extrusion, causing the door not to close properly. This is best done with a metal 2mm dia rod that is heated to rod hot then burning thru inner side only of extrusion, sufficiently spaced say every 500mm around to the entire perimeter of door seal.
Hi I had a similar issue, got new seals from Highwood Alfa in UK.
It turned out that there wasn't enough clearance at the 2 door hinge points, so the seal was being squashed in the hinge when closed. I trimmed the seals so they would not protrude into the hinge space - doors close nicely again.
Hope this helps.
Quote from: bonno on August 31, 2019, 10:11:20 PM
This is best done with a metal 2mm dia rod that is heated to rod hot then burning thru inner side only of extrusion, sufficiently spaced say every 500mm around to the entire perimeter of door seal.
Thanks for the replies.
I'll try melting small holes, but I'm not sure where to put the holes. Should the holes be on the top, middle or bottom of the rubber profile.
When viewed from outside looking in, the holes should be positioned so that they are not visible, say at the 9:00 o'clock position.
The issue is more the ability of air to escape as bonno mentioned. Try shutting the door with the window open and you will most likely find it much easier. That said, I still stretch the seals as installing them to ensure there isn't too much material between the door and aperture.
I am keen to increase the airflow and am interested in bonnos method. I have been thinking a one way flap built into the door somehow (at the bottom perhaps where not visible or the hinge side.
So I pulled off the new seals..
Much to my surprise they already had factory holes at regular intervals along the length..
Had a mature and experienced friend look at these door seals, and he agrees that, given the original samples, these new seals should be the bomb.
I pulled back the hinge side of the seal and they still resisted closing the doors.
Spoke with my almost local eccentric Alfa wrecker..He may have something, but i'm guessing he'll forget to look and/or phone me back.
He said you need to find the right supplier but was not anymore helpful than that.. I'm not going to keep rolling the dice and hoping. Otherwise I'll end up with a roomful of door seals that cost me $2000.
My brother with a 2000/105GTV (AngieGTV) advised that replacing Alfa door seals can be the veritable rabbit hole.
I think I can see the Mad Hatter from here..
Had a look at the door seals on my GTV and around the hinge areas the seal is much more deformed than the rest. Not sure how you can accelerate the deformation process that has taken several years to do, but one possible method could be steam or boiling water over that area to soften then close for a several days ( have attached couple of shots of the area in question).
Hey Bonno
I really appreciate your input and suggestions..I thank you enormously..if that is indeed an expression of gratitude.
As predicted, my Alfa wrecker forgot to search and/or call me.
As an aside I have a set of older but good sedan seals that, although are 10-15cm shorter than GTV, they may do the trick. I just may have to strategically patch in a good section of my original seals at an optimised area.
Can you get me a measurement of the door seals that don't fit?
Mainly a measurement of the diameter of the epdm round section, or bulb.
I may have found a source of seals in a variety of sizes through work.
The smallest suitable I found in 2 minutes looking; trim clip fits 1/16 or 1/32 wide, it's 3/8 deep and has a 3/8 bulb diameter (or if you prefer metric 1.6 or .8 x 9.5 x 9.5mm).
I'll have a measure of my original ones on the car when I get home...
I got home and measured the seal bulb that has seperated from the crimp. I'm measuring 10.2mm for the original seal. I have another look into it tomorrow.
Quote from: jazig.k on September 10, 2019, 04:51:23 PM
Can you get me a measurement of the door seals that don't fit?
Mainly a measurement of the diameter of the epdm round section, or bulb.
I may have found a source of seals in a variety of sizes through work.
The smallest suitable I found in 2 minutes looking; trim clip fits 1/16 or 1/32 wide, it's 3/8 deep and has a 3/8 bulb diameter (or if you prefer metric 1.6 or .8 x 9.5 x 9.5mm).
I'll have a measure of my original ones on the car when I get home...
I got home and measured the seal bulb that has seperated from the crimp. I'm measuring 10.2mm for the original seal. I have another look into it tomorrow.
So I have measured my seals: I'll call the rubber bulb "The D" as that's what it looks like in profile.
I think that the most important dimension(s) to consider is the outer dimension from the middle of the upright horizontally to the outer edge . And the thickness of the rubber.
See attachment:
So Red arrow = 12mm Green arrow = 2mm Blue arrow = 1.5
I hope that helps.
I think I have sorted the problem.. :) :)
I tried the set of good sedan door seals around the front 3/4 door cavity circumference. This option is tightish and snug but the doors now close fully and will bed in over time. I will also now harvest good sections from the GTV's old seals to complete the door's perimeter. This means there will be two seal joins per door, but should be easy enough to negate.
On a side note, upon closer inspection of the brand new seal sections, the soft "bulb"/D was actually much smaller than the original seal specification. This means that the original seals were bigger but have a larger hole to seal material ratio making them more flexible and compliant.
New seals 9-10mm diametre hole
Original seals 13 mm diametre hole
So to those looking to renew their door seals I would suggest that you ensure the hole is 13mm with of course the correct thickness of sponge rubber seal too.
I used the end caps from various marker pens as a feeler gauge to compare and measure...
You'd think, given the problem, that you'd maybe source an even smaller option, but the physics of it all disagree..
I went through the same experience in buying door seals from overseas vendors made specifically for the GTV6.
Could not shut the door without slamming it!
My solution was the local Clark Rubber store! Lots of rubber extrusion profiles available and I got one that worked fine.
(Sorry, I can't remember the exact one as it was a few years ago now).
Further to Victors post, I can only add that the extrusion profile when compressed must be no more than 3mm max, going from years of deformation around the hinge area.
Am happy with the sedan donor seals for now.
However, yes, I went to Clark rubber today and found a much much better seal profile solution..Almost identical to OEM I might hazard..
Perfect "bulb" size, and much more resilient and flexible than the new seal lengths that I had bought.
So think I'll burn the $100 paid for the new unusable seals and "store" them for the new ice age.
Having got the seals pretty good to go from the 116 donor sedan, I'm reluctant to roll the dice again on these Clarke rubber seals.. Although by all money they would be the go!!.. They are $15 metre at 4 metres a door..(= $120 for two doors) I am sure, but never certain of their suitability.. Only 120 bux but way more than that in frustration if they still don't do the job..
I think the spanner throwing and swearing isn't worth the odds of trying this option if they still don't work...
There you go.
Hi,
Thanks for sharing your info. Any reference numbers for the Clark Rubber seals that you found?
Cheers
for what its worth, I replaced one of my GTV door seals with Clark Rubber product about 18 months ago. No problems at all.
Find attached link to Clark rubber extrusion profiles. My guess is that the closest profiles for the GTV door seal are either profiles #39 - #45.
https://www.clarkrubber.com.au/rubber/extrusions?p=1
I don't know what number the one I bought was - I just took a slice of the original seal with me and compared it directly with the different rolls at Clark.
I'll swing by Clarke tomorrow and get the product number..
Not sure if it has the breather holes but I'll check that too..
Went back to Clarke Rubber
This is their shelf label for those interested.
I can't yet personally endorse this seal, but it is to my eye and measurements identical to the OEM seal.
Quote from: sportiva on September 27, 2019, 03:46:45 PM
I also have the Clark rubber seals in my GTV6. If you need to pull the door hard to close it, have a look at the striker on the door jam it is adjustable so sometimes a small adjustment will help.
The striker also has a plastic ring under an outer floating spring steel ring if the plastic ring is missing or worn out and the steel ring has too much play, closing the door can be difficult.
Thank you..Yes they are a bit hard to close without slamming..But at least they do close fully now..
I'm going to try to bed the donated sedan seals for a while and then I'll visit the striker adjustment. I think they have been adjusted tighter over the years as the old seals get flatter and flatter
Quote from: sportiva on September 27, 2019, 03:46:45 PM
I also have the Clark rubber seals in my GTV6. If you need to pull the door hard to close it, have a look at the striker on the door jam it is adjustable so sometimes a small adjustment will help.
The striker also has a plastic ring under an outer floating spring steel ring if the plastic ring is missing or worn out and the steel ring has too much play, closing the door can be difficult.
So, with old sedan seals fitted and only a small length of seal both sides to be added, all is now good.
LHS closes convincingly albeit with a push.. RHS will shut fully but a much bigger and less soundly push.
But looking at the striker plates...passenger side LHS is good and now greased up.. but the RHS (driver) striker has nothing but the loose metal ring...
The outer metal ring just moves around without restriction. How is this fixed?
Thank you brain trust
Hi Sudsy
So the striker plate attached to B pillar has the cylindrical part that engages to door mechanism loose. Remove the striker plate and see whether you are able to tighten (no provision to tighten when viewed). Failing this you may require a new or second hand replacement part. One final point, make sure that the mating mechanism is latching correctly and locks into position when engaged.