Twin Spark Cup 156 Project

Started by Alfatango, August 15, 2021, 10:45:59 PM

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bazzbazz

#60
Why would mounting it so make it more likely for the Extinguisher to accidentally discharge? They are designed to be near impossible to go off inadvertently.

For those of you unfamiliar with this discussion -

Basically a fire extinguisher is completely useless unless you can reach it!

So picture yourself in your track car, strapped in with your racing harness, as you take one of the more challenging corners at fill tilt, you accidentally slide off the track onto the soft grass, your outer wheels dig in and you flip onto your roof. As your hanging there tightly strapped in, quite safe and unharmed, but unable to move at all, you await the crash crew to arrive to extricate you from your indignant situation.

Suddenly there is a puff of smoke from somewhere, "OH CRAP!" Instantly the whole cabin is filled with blinding smoke and you hear the crackling of flames . . . . . you reach for the extinguisher . . . . . all the way over there, in the passenger foot well, (or any of the other idiotic places that I have seen so many drivers mount the extinguisher) go on, there it is, go for it, nope, not going to happen. BUGGER!

The extinguisher should be mounted in a position so -

A/ That with your eyes closed you can simply drop your arm and it naturally falls to hand, without you being able to see or move, AT ALL.

B/ You are able to un-clip the retaining straps with just the one hand only and easily remove from the retaining bracket. Again, while blind and unable to move, wiggle, or even turn your head any amount at all.

C/ Also, the extinguisher must be of a type where the safety pin/clip can be removed and it be operated easily while blind & wearing racing gloves.
On The Spot Alfa
Mobile Alfa Romeo Diagnostic/Repair/Maintenance/Service
Brisbane/Gold Coast
0405721613
onthespotalfa@iinet.net.au

warsch

I agree that you have to be able to reach the extinguisher while seated and strapped in.

However, they absolutely go off on their own. That happens, I  personally know a person who had it happen.

That being said, mine is right under my legs

bazzbazz

#62
Quote from: Alfatango on September 24, 2021, 07:15:53 AM
But if you are racing and another car hits your door, could that not have an impact on the fire extinguisher

Anything is possible, but the recommended location is to your left mounted on/above/near the floor tunnel/hump. As shown here -

https://www.flickr.com/photos/193874062@N06/51509746711/in/dateposted-public/

Quote from: warsch on September 24, 2021, 01:21:20 PM
That being said, mine is right under my legs

And as described in my scenario above,  it makes it completely useless, as being between your legs you need to lean forward to reach & release it. Your pinned to your seat upside down unable to move whatsoever, remember.

Still, it's much better than the passenger footwell.  :)
On The Spot Alfa
Mobile Alfa Romeo Diagnostic/Repair/Maintenance/Service
Brisbane/Gold Coast
0405721613
onthespotalfa@iinet.net.au

bazzbazz

On The Spot Alfa
Mobile Alfa Romeo Diagnostic/Repair/Maintenance/Service
Brisbane/Gold Coast
0405721613
onthespotalfa@iinet.net.au

Colin Edwards

One of these - probably the MFM400S for a sedan. Weight not so much of an issue

We have something similar to the LWM50 in our Formula Ford.  Weight and packaging a real issue.

https://www.conceptracegear.com.au/motorsport/fire-extinguishers/

Hand held extinguishers are not much use if you want to manage a fire you can't access instantly.  Although fires are rare, a Suppression Kit is a good investment given any significant fire will total your car.  Its not the damage to the plastic, wiring, electrical or engine that's the issue.  Even a small fire will stuff the metallurgy of the chassis.

Colin
Present
2023 Tonale Veloce
2018 Abarth 124 Spider
1987 75 3.0

Past
2020 Giulietta Veloce
2015 Giulietta QV
2009 159 3.2 Ti Q4
2012 Giulietta TCT Veloce
2006 147 Ti 2 door Selespeed
1979 Alfasud Ti 1.5

bazzbazz

Quote from: Alfatango on September 28, 2021, 12:45:49 PM
Martini stripe has begun. If you are doing a full car stripe you will need around 4m to 5m.

Reckon it'll be good for at least an extra 5 km/h down the straight. ;)
On The Spot Alfa
Mobile Alfa Romeo Diagnostic/Repair/Maintenance/Service
Brisbane/Gold Coast
0405721613
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warsch

Quote from: Alfatango on September 28, 2021, 12:45:49 PM
Martini stripe has begun. If you are doing a full car stripe you will need around 4m to 5m.

Where did you get the stripes from? I'm looking for them for my GTA

warsch

Quote from: Alfatango on September 29, 2021, 06:08:28 PM
Type in Martini into that Ebay store and they have lots of varieties.

I've tried that but didn't exactly likes what I found. Thanks for the links, that'll help me with new car prep. Heaps of things to do, but I'm going for the livery first

bazzbazz

#68
Wonder if a Power Chisel would be a better option, or perhaps an Air Hammer

They have various attachments that can be fitted.

Just a thought.

https://www.supercheapauto.com.au/p/blackridge-blackridge-air-hammer-and-4-piece-chisels-175mm/572838.html?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIvvyy6euy8wIVEDErCh2mQQC3EAQYAiABEgLs2fD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds
On The Spot Alfa
Mobile Alfa Romeo Diagnostic/Repair/Maintenance/Service
Brisbane/Gold Coast
0405721613
onthespotalfa@iinet.net.au

bazzbazz

Quote from: Alfatango on October 05, 2021, 07:54:12 PM
However wouldn't surprise me if I ended up with more downforce/ground effect holes that need to be welded up.

It's an Air Hammer/Power Chisel . . . . one uses it with a subtle touch . . . . not like a Jack Hammer.  ;)
On The Spot Alfa
Mobile Alfa Romeo Diagnostic/Repair/Maintenance/Service
Brisbane/Gold Coast
0405721613
onthespotalfa@iinet.net.au

warsch

Quote from: Alfatango on October 11, 2021, 12:17:44 PM
Here is what the towing strap will screw into. This requires the foam bit behind the bumper to come off or be cut up to fit. This will need a much bigger hole in the bumper as the D Bracket is lower as well.

I don't like the angle of force that will be applied to the plate. With its thickness it can just crack and snap. Unless it's some expensive brand name strap. Hence why I stick to standard eye bolts. Yes, they bend, but so what? They are also free.

Colin Edwards

Agree with use of the standard eye bolt.  However Schedule B (r) in the CAMS regs requires a 40mm dia "test tool" must be able to pass through the eye.  Its for this reason most people use an OMP, Sparco or whatever tow strap.  The return loop in the strap easily complies with the Schedule B (r) requirement.
Schedule B (r) also requires the tow device MUST support dragging the vehicle with all wheels locked across a sealed surface.  The recovery team MUST know what they are doing.  Seen some very brutal attempts at vehicle recovery with disastrous results!!
The tow strap plate could be bolted to the tow "eye" via the largest dia SHCS you can fit plus suitable flat washers.  Use a stainless steel nylock nut. 
The vehicle MUST be towed in line with the axis of the eye bolt or it may bend.  These eye bolts are drop forged like a spanner and "should" be pretty tough. 
Present
2023 Tonale Veloce
2018 Abarth 124 Spider
1987 75 3.0

Past
2020 Giulietta Veloce
2015 Giulietta QV
2009 159 3.2 Ti Q4
2012 Giulietta TCT Veloce
2006 147 Ti 2 door Selespeed
1979 Alfasud Ti 1.5

Colin Edwards

See attached image of what I knocked together for my 75.  The M10 shackle is rated to 1000kg and complies with AS 2741.  M10 refers to the pin diameter - not the "bow" or "D" section.
You could use one of these to fix the tow strap to the eye bolt. 
I joined 2 tow straps as the tow "loop" welded to the 75 chassis rail is a fair way back from the front bumper.  One tow strap would have been too short.
The two straps pictured are joined via an M10 SHCS.  These are class 10.9 - pretty tough!!  Around 1100MPa as I recall.
The Alfa eye bolt pictured (from the wifes Giulietta) has a 26mm wide eye - so technically not legal for motorsport use.  Must be no less than 40mm.   
If you use the biggest dia SHCS that will fit through the hole in the tow strap plate (DO NOT DRILL OUT OR MODIFY THE TOW STRAP IN ANY WAY) and a couple of M10 HEAVY square washers you should be good to go.
Present
2023 Tonale Veloce
2018 Abarth 124 Spider
1987 75 3.0

Past
2020 Giulietta Veloce
2015 Giulietta QV
2009 159 3.2 Ti Q4
2012 Giulietta TCT Veloce
2006 147 Ti 2 door Selespeed
1979 Alfasud Ti 1.5

warsch

Phew, I just had 4 weekends of race meets straight. The car handled it just fine. And with some solid seat time I was able to get close to my 2019 records and even beat a couple. Which is while nice but slightly disappointing as the car seems a bit quicker to accelerate.

I've also officially became a Competition Convenor for AROCA QLD chapter. And now trying to scramble ideas how to lure new and returning folks into sprints, racing and so on. So any ideas are welcome.

warsch

These are some good ideas, some of that I've already done in the capacity of just a competitor. But maybe I wasn't persistent enough but I'll obviously continue. I'm just thinking that the auditory and the media wasn't right.

I plan a series of posts explaining the process etc.

It's all fun and safe but then you run into stuff like this: