Author Topic: Twin Spark Cup 156 Project  (Read 36161 times)

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Alfatango

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Re: Twin Spark Cup & Enduro 156 Project
« Reply #105 on: September 22, 2021, 12:22:15 PM »
Yeah I found most modifications are pretty pointless besides brake pads and tyres for track days. But it's hard to tell as you would need to test them back to back and conditions are always changing.

Lots of the upgrades work, it's just that driver mod and seat time beats a lot of them too. Especially shaving off some 4 kg of roof liner.

In my opinion, adjustable coilovers are a must (but you can get away with some sporty suspension for some time), obviously brakes. All the other stuff works too, just does not translate straight to lap times. Polybushes, rose-jointed arms, braces and so on.

Yeah I was having this exact discussion with a friend. He is an avid iracer in the sim world but has never taken a car to the track. His criteria for a track car was that he wants to push a car on a track hard. He is talking about coil overs and sway bars etc and I told him to start going to a track in a half decent car with some ebc style brake pads and michellin tyres and go from there. In any sim game you can get the perfect lap after crashing 1000 times. In real life, just building up the courage to brake later than your previous braking point is a big thing. But it takes a long time to find the right braking point and it changes per track ;D. Conditions such as weather, lighting, grip levels change throughout a track day. Your car changes from track to track day as well on occasions. As you said warsch it's the driver mod and seat time that counts the most.
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Alfatango

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Re: Twin Spark Cup & Enduro 156 Project
« Reply #106 on: September 23, 2021, 05:09:19 PM »
Probably won't be applying for any tailor positions but at least I won't cut myself on metal. Pvc is $20, glue $10, material $10.
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Alfatango

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Re: Twin Spark Cup & Enduro 156 Project
« Reply #107 on: September 23, 2021, 05:15:22 PM »
It looked a bit better in my head  ::)
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Alfatango

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Re: Twin Spark Cup & Enduro 156 Project
« Reply #108 on: September 23, 2021, 05:20:46 PM »
Alfa romeo 156 front seat air bag and hand rest removal screws. Save someone destroying a seat in the future. Was going to use this as a sim racer seat but too heavy anyway.
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Alfatango

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Re: Twin Spark Cup & Enduro 156 Project
« Reply #109 on: September 23, 2021, 05:21:15 PM »
Hand rest
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Alfatango

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Re: Twin Spark Cup & Enduro 156 Project
« Reply #110 on: September 23, 2021, 05:23:26 PM »
A bit more weight saving plus don't want plastic projectiles in the cabin.
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bazzbazz

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Re: Twin Spark Cup & Enduro 156 Project
« Reply #111 on: September 23, 2021, 09:33:18 PM »
Just do me one favor, for your own sake don't place the Fire Extinguisher in the passenger foot well where so many people do. Otherwise you may as well just bolt a 1.5 Kg lead weight there instead, as doing so makes it completely useless.
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Alfatango

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Re: Twin Spark Cup & Enduro 156 Project
« Reply #112 on: September 23, 2021, 09:43:02 PM »
Just do me one favor, for your own sake don't place the Fire Extinguisher in the passenger foot well where so many people do. Otherwise you may as well just bolt a 1.5 Kg lead weight there instead, as doing so makes it completely useless.

I saw you congratulate the fire extinguisher in between the drivers seat and driver's door in the rally car thread. That makes more sense with a 6 point harness on I guess. But doesn't it also make it more likely to go off in an impact?
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bazzbazz

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Re: Twin Spark Cup & Enduro 156 Project
« Reply #113 on: September 24, 2021, 01:35:00 AM »
Why would mounting it so make it more likely for the Extinguisher to accidentally discharge? They are designed to be near impossible to go off inadvertently.

For those of you unfamiliar with this discussion -

Basically a fire extinguisher is completely useless unless you can reach it!

So picture yourself in your track car, strapped in with your racing harness, as you take one of the more challenging corners at fill tilt, you accidentally slide off the track onto the soft grass, your outer wheels dig in and you flip onto your roof. As your hanging there tightly strapped in, quite safe and unharmed, but unable to move at all, you await the crash crew to arrive to extricate you from your indignant situation.

Suddenly there is a puff of smoke from somewhere, "OH CRAP!" Instantly the whole cabin is filled with blinding smoke and you hear the crackling of flames . . . . . you reach for the extinguisher . . . . . all the way over there, in the passenger foot well, (or any of the other idiotic places that I have seen so many drivers mount the extinguisher) go on, there it is, go for it, nope, not going to happen. BUGGER!

The extinguisher should be mounted in a position so -

A/ That with your eyes closed you can simply drop your arm and it naturally falls to hand, without you being able to see or move, AT ALL.

B/ You are able to un-clip the retaining straps with just the one hand only and easily remove from the retaining bracket. Again, while blind and unable to move, wiggle, or even turn your head any amount at all.

C/ Also, the extinguisher must be of a type where the safety pin/clip can be removed and it be operated easily while blind & wearing racing gloves.
« Last Edit: September 24, 2021, 01:43:42 AM by bazzbazz »
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Alfatango

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Re: Twin Spark Cup & Enduro 156 Project
« Reply #114 on: September 24, 2021, 07:15:53 AM »
Thanks bazz. That makes sense as I have had the fire extinguisher in the passenger front seat rail holes and found that I have to undo the seat belt on a normal chair to get to it. So it would make sense for rallies, hill climbs and sprints. But if you are racing and another car hits your door, could that not have an impact on the fire extinguisher?

I think it was this user vid on a clk gtr le mans car that showed they have a switch which turns on foam or fire extinguishers in the cabin which really shows the separation between race car and road car. And the air Jacks would be super cool to have as well 8)

https://youtu.be/Lp-I5cRFrZU
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warsch

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Re: Twin Spark Cup & Enduro 156 Project
« Reply #115 on: September 24, 2021, 01:21:20 PM »
I agree that you have to be able to reach the extinguisher while seated and strapped in.

However, they absolutely go off on their own. That happens, I  personally know a person who had it happen.

That being said, mine is right under my legs

bazzbazz

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Re: Twin Spark Cup & Enduro 156 Project
« Reply #116 on: September 24, 2021, 02:50:45 PM »
But if you are racing and another car hits your door, could that not have an impact on the fire extinguisher

Anything is possible, but the recommended location is to your left mounted on/above/near the floor tunnel/hump. As shown here -

https://www.flickr.com/photos/193874062@N06/51509746711/in/dateposted-public/

That being said, mine is right under my legs

And as described in my scenario above,  it makes it completely useless, as being between your legs you need to lean forward to reach & release it. Your pinned to your seat upside down unable to move whatsoever, remember.

Still, it's much better than the passenger footwell.  :)
« Last Edit: September 24, 2021, 03:06:13 PM by bazzbazz »
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bazzbazz

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Re: Twin Spark Cup & Enduro 156 Project
« Reply #117 on: September 24, 2021, 05:37:42 PM »
As they say, timing is everything -

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Colin Edwards

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Re: Twin Spark Cup & Enduro 156 Project
« Reply #118 on: September 25, 2021, 09:47:35 AM »
One of these - probably the MFM400S for a sedan. Weight not so much of an issue

We have something similar to the LWM50 in our Formula Ford.  Weight and packaging a real issue.

https://www.conceptracegear.com.au/motorsport/fire-extinguishers/

Hand held extinguishers are not much use if you want to manage a fire you can't access instantly.  Although fires are rare, a Suppression Kit is a good investment given any significant fire will total your car.  Its not the damage to the plastic, wiring, electrical or engine that's the issue.  Even a small fire will stuff the metallurgy of the chassis.

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Alfatango

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Re: Twin Spark Cup & Enduro 156 Project
« Reply #119 on: September 25, 2021, 10:17:21 AM »
One of these - probably the MFM400S for a sedan. Weight not so much of an issue

We have something similar to the LWM50 in our Formula Ford.  Weight and packaging a real issue.

https://www.conceptracegear.com.au/motorsport/fire-extinguishers/

Hand held extinguishers are not much use if you want to manage a fire you can't access instantly.  Although fires are rare, a Suppression Kit is a good investment given any significant fire will total your car.  Its not the damage to the plastic, wiring, electrical or engine that's the issue.  Even a small fire will stuff the metallurgy of the chassis.

Colin

Thanks Colin. I can highly recommend getting a fire extinguisher and bracket from a motorsport store. I bought one of eBay and checked the pressure Guage on the fire extinguisher and it says none. I than got another one as a refund but don't trust either of them.

Didn't know what a suppression kit is so Googled it. https://www.whichcar.com.au/features/diy/how-to-fit-a-fire-suppression-system-to-your-car

I am starting to realize a professional race car is probably more than a road car with a stripped interior ;D
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