Author Topic: South African 3 Litre GTV6  (Read 23302 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Frank Failla

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 1
  • AROCA Member #: 6847
Re: South African 3 Litre GTV6
« Reply #15 on: August 07, 2018, 02:06:45 PM »
Hi John, GG105
I am currently in search of a set of pistons for a GTV6 SA. Who did you use to make the pistons for your car?

Globally we can get hi comp domed pistons, but these are not really suited to the GTV6 SA.

Hoping you can assist.

Thanks,
Frank

GG105

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 150
  • AROCA Member #: 2236
Re: South African 3 Litre GTV6
« Reply #16 on: August 13, 2018, 01:15:11 PM »
PM sent.
1959 Giulietta Sprint
1969 GT 1300 Junior
1970 Giulia 1300 TI
1975 Ferrari 365 GT4
1990 Mazda MX5
2005 BMW 330Ci
2014 Porsche Turbo

GG105

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 150
  • AROCA Member #: 2236
Re: South African 3 Litre GTV6
« Reply #17 on: September 14, 2018, 09:09:33 AM »
Help needed!

The GTV6 is now running and has been road tested. It goes very well and the noise, even at 4,000 rpm is epic. The addition of power steering and the ball joint risers has made a great difference to the driving experience. We still have some stuff to sort, the usual washer bottle dilemma, some new pads, bonnet lining and some detailing to complete, but weíre on the way.

But I do need some help to complete it. Does anyone have an inside drivers door handleand a pair of the plastic slide on surrounds?


1959 Giulietta Sprint
1969 GT 1300 Junior
1970 Giulia 1300 TI
1975 Ferrari 365 GT4
1990 Mazda MX5
2005 BMW 330Ci
2014 Porsche Turbo

GG105

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 150
  • AROCA Member #: 2236
Re: South African 3 Litre GTV6
« Reply #18 on: September 14, 2018, 09:24:28 AM »
Some earlier photos before we put the engine back in.

1959 Giulietta Sprint
1969 GT 1300 Junior
1970 Giulia 1300 TI
1975 Ferrari 365 GT4
1990 Mazda MX5
2005 BMW 330Ci
2014 Porsche Turbo

GeeTV

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 81
Re: South African 3 Litre GTV6
« Reply #19 on: September 14, 2018, 01:15:57 PM »
Sorry I can't help with your requests but what I will say is 'WOW!'..... Absolutely love your work!
Hope I get to see & hear this in the flesh.

GG105

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 150
  • AROCA Member #: 2236
Re: South African 3 Litre GTV6
« Reply #20 on: September 18, 2018, 08:31:21 PM »
Here are a couple of photos of the extractors we fitted. We couldnít use the ones on the car because one side had 44mm fitted, whilst the other had 40mm. Go figure. We ceramic coated them before fitting them.

I thought you might want to see a better picture of the carbies installed. We estimate the engine is producing around 250 flywheel hp, but of course this is a guess.
1959 Giulietta Sprint
1969 GT 1300 Junior
1970 Giulia 1300 TI
1975 Ferrari 365 GT4
1990 Mazda MX5
2005 BMW 330Ci
2014 Porsche Turbo

GG105

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 150
  • AROCA Member #: 2236
Re: South African 3 Litre GTV6
« Reply #21 on: September 18, 2018, 08:33:51 PM »
This side is better.

1959 Giulietta Sprint
1969 GT 1300 Junior
1970 Giulia 1300 TI
1975 Ferrari 365 GT4
1990 Mazda MX5
2005 BMW 330Ci
2014 Porsche Turbo

GG105

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 150
  • AROCA Member #: 2236
Re: South African 3 Litre GTV6
« Reply #22 on: October 06, 2018, 09:46:07 AM »
I thought it might be useful to detail the differences between the Arese built 116 GTVs and the SA built cars, to the extent I am aware of them and understanding that I only have my car and pictures on the web for reference. As I havenít seen a pre one piece dash car, these comments will be limited to post 83 cars. This isnít specific to the 3 litre cars. Happy to stand corrected on any of this.

Exterior.

The most obvious difference is the wide side moldings which are unique to the SA built cars. I think the red tape on the molds, bumper inserts and grille is unique to the 3 litre cars. Ignoring the specific 3 litre differences, I think the exterior is the same as Arese. I have seen the long whippy centre roof aerial on a number of photos of SA cars, mine has one, so I suspect this may also be standard. As has been discussed elsewhere, I think, with the possible exception of red, the colours are unique to SA. My colour is called Ice White

Interior

There are differences here. My car is a non sunroof car (thank goodness) and its interior is largely original. Unlike our cars, the headlining is black cloth, the seats use the same velour material however, the mounts are quite different and the seats are mounted higher than ours, particularly the passengers seat. We thought they had been modified but on close inspection look factory. The pattern in the vinyl of the headrests is different as are the armrests. The armrests donít have the little silver plastic insert. Otherwise, it all looks the same. Interestingly, at least some of the split dash cars have the later Recaro seats, I assume these are late 82/early 83 cars, with the new interior but using up the supply of split dashes.

The earliest 3 litres, built in 82, have split dashes, most have the single piece dash, like mine, which was built in 83. I suspect most were built in 83, there may be some 84s, they ran out of wheel sets so the last cars have GTV6 wheels.
1959 Giulietta Sprint
1969 GT 1300 Junior
1970 Giulia 1300 TI
1975 Ferrari 365 GT4
1990 Mazda MX5
2005 BMW 330Ci
2014 Porsche Turbo

GeeTV

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 81
Re: South African 3 Litre GTV6
« Reply #23 on: October 08, 2018, 10:46:17 AM »
^ Don't forget that famous bonnet!

sportiva

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 694
Re: South African 3 Litre GTV6
« Reply #24 on: October 08, 2018, 06:53:31 PM »
Tell us about the ENGINE bore and stroke... camshaft lift and duration
And the gearset and final drive ratios
« Last Edit: October 08, 2018, 06:56:17 PM by sportiva »
3.0 GTV6 Fiat Free
156JTS

ex
75 2.5
2.0 Alfetta Sportiva #22
1.8 Alfetta
1.2 alfasud
2 75 parted out
15 alfettas parted
10 gtv parted
5 alfasuds parted
156 sele

carlo rossi

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 730
  • AROCA Member #: 8733
Re: South African 3 Litre GTV6
« Reply #25 on: October 09, 2018, 07:05:31 PM »
sportiva stop it and hear the gears in your mind you dont want to mod your motor to 3 ltr put a 3.2 in and be done with it
PS love that motor and workshop
great to see the carbs would be a fabulous sound love to hear it post a video
current cars
red 83 gtv 2.0


previous cars
Red 76 1.2/1.5 alfasud ti
white 79 alfetta 2000
alfetta 74 1.8
escort Lotus twin cam
bikes
ducati 900 ss 1979
moto morini 3 1/2 sport 1975/6
Moto morini 3 1/2 valentini speciale 77 oh and a deltek rockhopper

sportiva

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 694
Re: South African 3 Litre GTV6
« Reply #26 on: October 10, 2018, 03:27:30 PM »
I just can't help myself, Carlo, I need to know these technical details eg, did Autodelta make a bespoke crankshaft for the SA3.0 or is it the same as the production 3.0 that came with the Alfa75.
3.0 GTV6 Fiat Free
156JTS

ex
75 2.5
2.0 Alfetta Sportiva #22
1.8 Alfetta
1.2 alfasud
2 75 parted out
15 alfettas parted
10 gtv parted
5 alfasuds parted
156 sele

Dna Dave

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 276
Re: South African 3 Litre GTV6
« Reply #27 on: October 10, 2018, 03:58:42 PM »
Copied from Wikipedia

0 SA (Autodelta)   Edit
The original 2.5 engine as used in the Alfa Sei was bored and stroked by Autodelta, the former Alfa Romeo racing department to match the racing rules for South African and Australian championships. Bore was increased from 88 mm (3.5 in) to 93 mm (3.7 in) and a new crankshaft stroked to 72 mm (2.8 in). The total displacement was 2,939.5 cc (179.38 cu in) and it's a totally different engine from the later 3.0 (2,959 cc (180.6 cu in)) that powered the 75/Milano models. It was, too, a 2-valve-per-cylinder design with a single belt-driven camshaft per cylinder bank and six carburettors fitted. Special camshafts and carbs were used giving a power figure of 176.4 PS (130 kW; 174 hp) at 5800 rpm. Torque was 222 N⋅m (164 lb⋅ft) at 4300 rpm, while compression ratio was 9:1.

Only 174 complete GTV6 3.0 SA cars were produced in 1984 plus 68 more in 1985. the last ones were fitted with EFI.

1984 GTV6 3.0L South Africian (charcoal)
1991 Alfa 75 Potenziata
1985 GTV6 South Africian Rep (white) 3.2L gta motor
1976 Alfetta gt (not your average gt)
2009 Alfa Mito VRA Racecar

Past,

Not that many 😜

carlo rossi

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 730
  • AROCA Member #: 8733
Re: South African 3 Litre GTV6
« Reply #28 on: October 10, 2018, 05:07:41 PM »
Dave the 3.0  I was told used the same crank as the 2,5 but cleverley they offset the bigend by 2mm and the piston gudgeon the same amout giving it 4 mm extra stroke
so special pistons and 5mm bigger bore as you said
is this true?
« Last Edit: October 10, 2018, 10:18:51 PM by carlo rossi »
current cars
red 83 gtv 2.0


previous cars
Red 76 1.2/1.5 alfasud ti
white 79 alfetta 2000
alfetta 74 1.8
escort Lotus twin cam
bikes
ducati 900 ss 1979
moto morini 3 1/2 sport 1975/6
Moto morini 3 1/2 valentini speciale 77 oh and a deltek rockhopper

GG105

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 150
  • AROCA Member #: 2236
Re: South African 3 Litre GTV6
« Reply #29 on: November 20, 2018, 02:08:47 PM »
After one of the most alternately frustrating and depressing restos I've done. The GTV6 is 95% finished. 95% because there's always a bit more to do. Apart from the obvious and usual GTV6 issues setting it up to run properly was a mission. My car has big cams, Dawie de Villiers who built them in SA tells us that mine is probably one of the race engines as most of them had the road 2.5 cams. The carbs were set up on a bench, which is pretty much the only way you can do them without spending a lot of money and sending your favourite mechanic, engineer and dyno operator around the twist! This is why so many you see for sale os have engines and/or carbs in pieces.

This is what we did. Finally we got it right, after far too much time and money. It really needs an idle step up for the a/c but its ok. It now runs really well, the a/c is excellent and the power steer transforms the car.   
1959 Giulietta Sprint
1969 GT 1300 Junior
1970 Giulia 1300 TI
1975 Ferrari 365 GT4
1990 Mazda MX5
2005 BMW 330Ci
2014 Porsche Turbo