I've been offered a 147 TS 5 door that has some useful bits for my purposes. Some, not all. It would leave me with other, possibly saleable stuff.
Price is not unreasonable, but past experience has me aware there's folly in spending work hours parting out a car when it will return less than my preferred hourly rate. :-\
Am I on the mark or close to, with the following as actual selling prices for Sydney suburbia (as opposed to some well-known traders' asking prices):
- Engine <130K with books and 24 months old belts/variator/stat/etc is worth about $200
- Leather seats (plain teabag pattern, not Ti stitching) including unbroken console and centre rear headrest is worth no more than $250
- Complete audio system with door speakers, subwoofer, boot trim panel and all wiring would fetch $200 tops
Happy to hear critiques, be told I'm dreaming etc.
Best way to see if your in the ball park figure for parting out is to do a comparison with similar items on Gumtree & eBay.
Of course it also depends on what the car is going to cost you in the first place.
Just remember one thing, people usually like to be able to see the part before buying, are YOU in a suitable location?
Baz
Yes, location is easy to sort - I can leave big things at a workshop I haunt. :)
When checking asking rates, I see prices that appear insanely high. I'm not in it for a career, the "easy option" is to cherrypick what I need, save a few small choice items (fuel flap, door mirrors etc) and crush the rest - but it then restricts the potential benefits to other enthusiasts...
HI CB
The prices seem to be reasonable/good, just several tips for advertising are as follows;
1. Prices is for pickup only via prior arrangement or buyer to arrange freight at buyers expense (the packaging of motor and in fact other items identified can be a little difficult) so local pickup is preferred.
2. Good description of engine, if possible include hear running.
3. Interior seats are to include photos and in the description if door cards are included.
4. Radio and associated speakers to include radio code is to be supplied.
5. What other items are to be included whether body panels, instrument cluster, mirrors, etc.
So if your initial purchase price is such that you only need to keep several of the parts and recoup outlay, then the return on breaking out is a no brainer, just a little time and effort. Additionally, if you have the space the need to dismantle parts can be done at the time of sale.
CB fogot to include another option and that is to set it up for the Twin spark Cup or to sell it as a complete car as there might be interested people if became available as a going vehicle.
Hi Bonno,
That I would need to basically chop the back off it, means the car would not be usable as a track project. All I want from it are:
Rear cut, not including tailgate
Boot trim (plastics and carpet)
Underfelt for beneath rear seat
Door mirrors and fuel flap (for spares; history/experience shows these as damage prone)
Instrument cluster lens (mine is cracked on the Sele)
LH C-pillar interior trim (ditto)
Driver's door switch panel
Rubber liners from console section forward of gearstick and beside handbrake
Cup-holder gizmo from centre dash
Timing and aux belt covers from motor
Sun visors without floppy mirror covers (rocking-horse poo!)
That would leave a whole lot of good stuff to share around, the catch being that I don't have a dusty corner in which I can slowly pick meat off the bones. I can stack a couple of doors, motor and tranny in the back of the workshop but that's about all. I'm not sure that using the outlaws' carport at their weekender would make me popular.
So, you can sort of see my conundrum; if I pull the trigger on this car it needs to be resolved in a timely manner and that means not being in la-la land with pricing.
[Side note] I've never had a radio code situation with an Alfa, with the Frogs you just edit the VIN as stored in the radio via diagnostics, so it matches the body computer's idea of the VIN. I don't know how you enter the code in a Blaupunkt head unit, or if it's reliably obtainable on the market like some other brands. Education welcome. :)
It looks like this may come into my hands at the right price (ie, so I don't end up spending thousands on used parts that may be barely different to what I now have).
I'll be thinning out the items aggressively and quickly, most on a FCFS basis. Good-natured banter and insults are welcome.
Here's the car in question, it actually experienced "un bacio di legno", courtesy of a large bluegum.
First person to say "That'll buff out" wins a special prize - I'll sell them my next used oil filter at half the new trade price. That's a bargain for road-tested premium quality parts. :P
I've trailered it back to my catapecchia spacious abode, and will start dismantling it shortly. Unfortunately, due to my rubbish Italian, negotiations will be preferably in Inglese.
Looks like the prior owner was parked very carefully while transporting the mother in law.
I literally LOL'd at your idea, and the fact it immediately gave me evil thoughts. ;D
Interestingly, a passenger under the worst damage would likely be fine. The shell distortion is textbook and while the door is stuck the hatch opens reasonably.
Ahhh yes, but what you don't realise is that the cunning bastard had the mother in law strapped to the roof rack! ;)
Now lets see with that idea what mental images pop into that twisted little mind of yours . . . . ;D
Hmm!
Broke out my mad panel beating skills from watching East European videos... (Hey Warsch - khoroshiy rabota, net?)
Good as new.
Quote from: Citroënbender on January 16, 2018, 09:48:00 PM
Broke out my mad panel beating skills from watching East European videos... (Hey Warsch - khoroshiy rabota, net?)
Я бы не сказал русскому, что он часть Восточной Европы, безопаснее сказать ему, что это часть России! ;)
...... why are we doing this again ? :)
"Hey Siri,
Why are we doing this again?"
:P
[Aside] I've found (identified) the Covertly Missing Part.
You know how when you buy a complete parts car, inevitably there is something not quite as you expected? One I purchased had the entire TI suspension swapped out for junk.
Well, this car - when I first set eyes on it, I popped the boot and had a look at the crush damage. Boot wasn't really set to close again, such being the distortion of the shell. The next week when I came to pay and collect, strapped the boot down with an ocky, thought nothing of it. At my house that night, carefully latched the boot shut. The next time I went to open the boot, no dice - eventually I squeezed through the folded down seat back and released it manually. Having a look at the boot latch for sticking (I could hear the body module relay clicking when the release button was pressed) revealed no solenoid. I guess that would do it!
What do I do with the side (curtain) airbags?
Any hit large enough to set these off, will render a car of this age/species economically unrepairable - so the market for spare side bags is presumably nil.
Does anyone in Sydney want them to play with?
It's about time you name yourself AlfaBender.
It'll be two years in April since I last bent anything. Hoping that timespan continues to grow. )))
Been testing the eLearn method for dash removal, seems to work OK. Column lower uni was the most stuck I've ever encountered - had to violently jiggle the wheel left and right after removing the pinch bolt and spreading the joint clamp ever so slightly. Wasn't going to hammer or pry heavily.
Hey Bazz - or anyone else who might have experience in this matter...
eLearn says you take out the magnesium dash frame and heater box as one. Is it not practicable to remove the heater box from under the dash frame, assuming the floor is down to the metal? Asking because I have memories of what a mongrel the frame top fixings were to access with the screen still fitted.
I'm disappointed nobody has insulted the quality of my offerings yet. :P Jousting sticks are available at extra cost, with any item offered.
Going to skive off a couple of bits as "Suit TS Cup" - not really good enough for a treasured road car but more than suited to tussling on a racetrack.
Quote from: bazzbazz on January 17, 2018, 02:26:37 AM
Quote from: Citroënbender on January 16, 2018, 09:48:00 PM
Broke out my mad panel beating skills from watching East European videos... (Hey Warsch - khoroshiy rabota, net?)
Я бы не сказал русскому, что он часть Восточной Европы, безопаснее сказать ему, что это часть России! ;)
LOL.
Re the prices at the start of this thread. I thought good condition leather interiors went for like $500+
Well that's what I see people asking on Gumtree anyway.
Quote from: Citroënbender on January 13, 2018, 10:41:15 PM
Here's the car in question, it actually experienced "un bacio di legno", courtesy of a large bluegum.
First person to say "That'll buff out" wins a special prize - I'll sell them my next used oil filter at half the new trade price. That's a bargain for road-tested premium quality parts. :P
I've trailered it back to my catapecchia spacious abode, and will start dismantling it shortly. Unfortunately, due to my rubbish Italian, negotiations will be preferably in Inglese.
Squash it on the other side and sell it as a GT :D :P
Good approach with the GT conversion; least effort maximum return. 8)
I moved the interior to Fleabay, not a single watcher, not one cheeky offer yet. Would rather someone felt they got $400 worth of seats at $200 than suffered buyer's remorse at a higher price. It's just my nature; if I borrowed your chainsaw it would come back clean, new chain, fuelled up. That sort of old-school idea of integrity and respect.
Hey is the breaker a manual BTW?
And if yes, is there much slop in the gear stick or is it tight with good selection?
Mine has heaps of slop and gear selection is finally getting tricky, especially reverse.
Given my boys are learning to drive in the car I was preparing my wallet for a brand new replacement assembly......
That breaker same bits as an 05? ;) ;)
Bugger! This one's a Selespeed.
The only manual gearshift I have that doesn't quite feel like a joyride on the town bike, is stashed in Wagga and I wasn't expecting to be near there for a few weeks.
You've seen the bushing kits from Partsworld, Desira, Steve whatshisface (Edit: Steve Brooke, AKA "panterasteve") etc, I take it? Sing out if not, I'll furnish some details.
Job is possible (replacement or O/haul) on ramps/stands but allow a solid day.
Take the leather gaiter from the gearstick surround off and any other covering so you can see the nylon housing that the gear stick ball mount is captured in.
Make sure the nylon housing is not cracked or split, this also causes "sloppy gearstick syndrome". :)
All Rise!
(Magistrate Hoppit enters)The Kangaroo Court is now in session.
:)
I'm trawling through a stack of largely irrelevant documents from the breaker, and found it has been on a diet of 5W40 FS for quite some time - say 60K of 127K total.
Now, this is something that many of us Would Not Do. Whether we stump up for Selenia or go Penrite, the key has been to seek out healthy levels of ZDDP in an oil, and a correct base/additive oil package generally.
The reason for seeking arguments in both prosecution and defence, is:
- I've already offered the motor to someone (before I was aware of this detail), and terms would likely be quite agreeable to both parties.
- However, I seek to be upstanding in my dealings and would like a buyer to be best informed as to the likely prospects of their purchase.
Suggestions are invited; it has crossed my mind to get a lab oil analysis but not sure how much this costs in Sydney at present, nor where it may be done.
Hi CB
There are several companies that provide Oil Sample Testing service refer to following links. Nulon provide a do it yourself kit and post results process.
NULON
https://www.engineoiltest.com.au/?gclid=CjwKCAiA78XTBRBiEiwAGv7EKv5y5TvxfT7jHbHdGFWUXUzfG4GMyE8qlE1blbRWHgX71fIiOn4cTRoCwygQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds
SGS
https://campaigns.sgs.com/en/oil-and-gas/oil-condition-monitoring-ocm?gclid=CjwKCAiA78XTBRBiEiwAGv7EKuFkrdrHzvxJrDkopOq4S-2MnKt2Cfj36M0eBddaMjk2k_jXGjAUjhoCZ_0QAvD_BwE
ALS
https://www.alsglobal.com/locations/asia-pacific/pacific/australia/nsw/sydney-oil-fuel-coolant-analysis-tribology
Thank you, the Nulon one may be just the ticket. I was expecting a lot dearer, $200-ish.
For the price your selling the engine for "$200", is it really worth it (arrange test sample and run engine)!!!!. Maybe a simple random check on condition of crankshaft journal & associated bearing and cam lobe (wear visual & dimensional) is a better option.
I've been looking for an "excuse" to buy the extra long Ribe bit to release the sump screws. :)
The potential issue with the motor's sale otherwise would be that transport adds appreciably, to the buyer's costs. So I'm not just seeing it as only a $200 motor.
What do you (or anyone else) feel about the amount of time its been run on 5/40? Gut feelings, people, just curious.
Found a cute bit of engraving when doing a pre-dismantle clean under the bonnet...
(Found the matching receipt from late 2013; $720 accumulator, $105 pump relay (OEX brand), $695 exchange pump, inclusive of labour. There's a reason we love to DIY. ;) )
Good God !
I charge $100 for an exchange Pump and 2-3 hrs labour to fit, calibrate and test it.
I gotta raise my prices! ::)
And engrave your work!
Quote from: Citroënbender on February 02, 2018, 03:57:40 PM
What do you (or anyone else) feel about the amount of time its been run on 5/40? Gut feelings, people, just curious.
;) )
When buying a second hand motor vehicle, you can establish a reasonable level of confidence and reduce the level of risk by taking it for a test drive. From a practical point of view, this is not possible when buying an engine from an automotive recycler, as they provide some warranty (3 months) to reduce the likelihood of a defective engine. They base their pricing on the kms travelled and associated vehicle log book records (if available). Getting back to your original question, what is the likelihood of long term engine damage/wear, using the lower grade oil over several years. My personal view is Yes, BUT with unknown variables thrown in, such as driving conditions, city V highway driving, frequency of oil & filter changes, etc. Additionally, what guarantee is there that the correct grade oil was used, by the local mechanic carrying out the service (check log book/service records does it stipulate grade of oil used).
What do you (or anyone else) feel about the amount of time its been run on 5/40? Gut feelings, people, just curious.
Gut feeling as follows:
Isn't it the case that 60W oil was / is 'retro specified' mainly to address oil consumption issues with the TS engine? Is it not also true that 40W oils are listed in the handbook as being suitable?
I'm not aware of any viscosity related wear issues abnormally specific to the TS (may exist, just not aware of any). I'd be surprised if 40W oils per se were problematic for wear, assuming reasonably frequent change intervals and use of otherwise appropriately specced oil.
I've tried both Penrite 40W and 60W oils in my TS engine. The not surprising main difference is that the thicker oil gets 'consumed' a bit more slowly, but seems to increase fuel consumption (slightly). On the other hand I find that the engine feels sublty 'happier' with the thinner oil, but any difference is so small I can't dismiss some degree of semi random placebo effect...
Regards,
John.
Thank you both. I personally don't know what to think about the oil!
I'm leaning towards the Nulon sampling kit, I'd actually add it to the asking price as an asset (hard data).
Re the sump, I see the two special tools (parts 1.822.144.000 and 1.822.145.000) are about €30 together plus freight. Has anyone bought them? I'm not quite clear on whether they're long sockets or some sort of male/female extender of the machine screws.
I've stored the breaker while I finish a huge re-wiring job, plain out of car space! It did give up rear exterior door handles for the '01, whose handle pivots had massively corroded and stuck. Very impressed with how quick these were to swap.
First of all, manual for my 2002 156 says 10W-40 oil. So it's not like this oil is completely bad. While 10W-60 is better, I personally believe that changing oil on time or before and using full synt matters much more. Otherwise, rather than spend money on oil tests, you could just lower the price by the same amount. Buying 2nd hand engine is a lottery anyway, unless you take the engine apart.
Quote from: johnl on February 02, 2018, 05:29:12 PMIsn't it the case that 60W oil was / is 'retro specified' mainly to address oil consumption issues with the TS engine? Is it not also true that 40W oils are listed in the handbook as being suitable?
Yes AND no, the change to 10w60 was to mainly to address Camshaft wear & Oil consumption.
Early 156 & 147 Twin-spark handbooks DID state 10w40 but later manuals the handbooks changed the specs to 10w60 for all Twin-sparks.
To my knowledge all 2.0 JTS were always 10w60.
The trick with these engines is to MAINTAIN the oil level, non enthusiast drivers have a tendency not to check the oil regularly and allow it to drop way too low, causing wear. (Every Alfa post sold post 2000 has a little sticker up on the drivers top corner stating this critical maintenance chore) Once the wear has started there is not much one can do about it except maintain the level, as once wear takers place, the lower you allow the oil to drop, the faster the consumption.
Thanks bazzbazz.
One of the 147s I looked at when looking at 147s had no oil evident on the dipstick. I didn't even bother to take it for a test drive...
Regards,
John.
If we flop onto Mr Joy's chaise longue for another session and examine our gravest fears through the soothing fug of a Trabuco cigar - do the shells wear significantly ahead of the journals (meaning in this case, that one can theoretically linish/buff the journals and go std bearings once again) - or is it commonplace to find that +10 or +20 is called for?
I don't really know, but most modern cranks seem to be very hard on the surface and rarely wear significantly, unlike many cranks of yore, most of which had a quite soft surface.
In the good old days it would have been unusual for a crank to not need a 'regrind' when rebuilding the engine, which was a common requirement (lots of cars had one or more engine rebuilds in their life. It would not have been unusual to find cranks that had been reground more than once. These days most engines easily outlast the car, and still have a lot of life left when the car is scrapped.
Regards,
John.
Especially true in Australia, where a couple of dings in a fifteen year old car will earn it Statutory Write-Off designation.
The shells should be marked with what thickness they are. As long as there has been no significant problem with the engine, run out of oil, con-rod issues ect, and there is no obvious damage to the crank just replace with new units of the original thickness fitted, which is normally standard 0.00. But make sure you confirm which shells are currently fitted.
I note for the Sydneians, Nick-a-Part loaded in a minty 147 tudor yesterday (9th) and the parts prices are dirt cheap. So even my apparently cheap rates may be too high.
Bacio di Legno has entered its final days.
(https://i.postimg.cc/3W9Q1tBn/AA81-F650-33-B4-4-F40-886-E-BDFA3762-A4-AB.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/3W9Q1tBn) (https://i.postimg.cc/D8MkkmRG/BDA7-EF85-C62-F-41-BC-8206-ED90-DD157-DC0.jpg) (https://postimg.cc/D8MkkmRG)
"...until you return to the ground, for you were taken therefrom, for dust you are, and to dust you will return."